Interesting questions have been raised (constantly) about our club and a SCAPEGOAT to blame.
Personally I am usually quick in seeing obvious problems and when you look at the period my experience covers, I have seen most of the things that only Parramatta supporter's can lament and relate to.
This particular one is a quandry, I think MONS needs to go, but I don't actually blame him for any of the events that recognise the damage that has been outlined. I think he could be sitting back in his arm chair asking how he ended up in this mess?.......... I don't think he has ever been the final decision maker on most of the things we would like to blame him for.
The other protaganist and yes Scapegoat is Jim Saratinos? So I am going to critique both him and MON's and explain why they have been blamed
The pathways coaches are recognised for their strong roles in rescuing the situation post Covid and I see no blame evolving there (unless it is still evolving).....the fan base tend's to overate them (our juniors) because we should be so strong in this area, yes we are a Development Club and we do provide a lot of players.....we would it seems not be overly good at bringing through the ones that we would like to claim. Maybe we are just victim's of that process as we have struggled to obtain balance with juniors and recruitment and in endeavoring to satisfy that equation.......Fcuked up Both!
Reverting to MONS you need to go back to his recruitment, he probably was never the right guy to table as General Manager Football whereas the reality is that the first grade coach in both BA's and JR's terms have been the final arbitar in almost all decisions outside of the financial impact of cap and policy. I think MON's has probably done a fine job in structuring and recruiting pathway coaches, even the women's coach.
So this leads me to the final "scapegoat" Bernie Gurr! What!! you say....the guys the best thing to happen post the renaissance!.... yes that's true! he did a great job...but did he finish it?
I blame Bernie because he recruited MON as a General Manager Football, a role that he showed was pretty toothless because BA's power was at its peak and he (BA) really was the guy, making the decisions on recruitment and retention. Yes the position (GM) was part of the review, but a more constructive process would have allowed the person to grow into the role where the structure allowed it to.
MON's went about his business developing pathways and faciltating people in lower level's behind First and Second Grade and executing signings made for him. Never really empowered in the primary sense..
Jim Saratinos inherited Bernie's role, Jim is obviously a fine administrator and financial manager.....as a CEO empowered to be much more decisive about football matters, he simply wasn't !
Based on his inexperience in that role which he basically stayed out of and during the initial period that he came in, he saw/ recognised that BA had things under control and was content to leave it at that.
Intelligent people do quickly learn just the same and all the time this was happening Jim was learning heaps about the football side and I can only presume making judgements of the relative incumbents. He never had the football background or experience that Bernie had, who would have maybe acted very differently if he chose to stay on.....he left for greener pastures in the states, but is to this day still a passionate Parramatta supporter.
So we were left with our primary scapegoats and to evaluate the thoughts that come through this forum, we need to understand better than we do that things are not as Black and White to just go out and attack individuals for the perception of their failures.
Too many people on here put themselves in a position of decision makers, whereas they have no real understanding of how business works or things happen, everyone is entitled to an opinion, not saying that, just saying that the intelligence and actual judgement of making these things happen are stuffed up in a lot of busineses without thinking the guys have no fcuking idea!
I can only think of our politicians in comparison, but just remember, you put them there as well!!!
I don't have the answers BTW but Iam writing this so an understanding of the pieces that make up the "Parra Lament" are understood better. Everyone seems to have the answers by "sacking MON and JS" without understanding how pieces fit and what needs to be done......My initial reaction is that MON needs to go, because his credibility has now got huge question marks and that JIM needs to stay as I think we need a CEO like him but with the understanding of having proper GM Football who reports through him.....the GM Football needs a lot of thought because I would actually have Ryles also reporting to him, with a clear defintion I might add. Obviously that person needs to be very "powerful" to command such a role!
An after thought by the way and not a recommendation, is that Jason Ryles could be a great GM Football and he appoints a coach to work under him! Early days for such a move, but I think that's where a lot of these processes need to head in the sense of how a coach is perceived......Foz's example of a coach and what he is achieving is an example that the modern day coach can keep it simple and the GM does the slogging!
An heirachel structure at Parra could be GM Football runs all Football Matters.....reports through CEO for Finance & Administration Matters...... . First Grade Coach reports through and appointed by GM Football,........ Manager Pathways and Administration reports through GM Football.
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The very reason Mark O'Neil has so much power as General Manager Football Operations, was to ensure the club had continuity seperate from the coach. The club realised after going through 8 coaches in 10 years (2005 - 2014), that there was no continuity for the club with planning for the future. Coachs tended to go the quick fix and overlooked the long term health of the plying roster. Mark O'Neil has more power then you think Pops, making up the 4 man R&R committee. His job description is player negotiation.
This is where i get concerned, it's public knowledge the players Ryles / his coaching staff and Ben Rogers are identifying as ones they want or ones they want to negotiate and buy. The reins get handed over to O'Neil to work out the negotiations, the black and whote contracts. This is where i'm suggesting the downfall is. That negotiation , that ability to lay down the red carpet, to woo the player, to show him the future, to structure the contract etc. There is so much involved in wooing these players and finding a financial, family life balance, that one in this position must do his homework on the player they are targeting, find what he needs or wants to compliment playing for the Eels. He must be a salesman as well as a financial guru. Mark O'Neil could really do with some help in this area, through the amount of players he has lost from the club or missed out on signing is proof that our salesman may not be the best.
Surely we can make a new position within the R&R dept , chief negotiator etc. Give Mark O'Neil more help, he misses too many things. Shane Richardson for example pay him what he wants to become our Chief negotiator, club patron etc. It's win / win isn't it.
I always thought Brian Smith would be great without undermining who is already there. Only issue is he has t got experience in back room role, but then again in 2000's coaches were basically that as it was.
I understand where you are coming from LB, but his style would be pretty dated now and he would not have the influence he once possesed.
Though I wonder if his negotiation tactics are better than what we currently have. I understand he won't have that appeal being out of the game for over a decade and a half but he was able to talk players into coming. Again could be way off but it is some experience in terms of football. He would be still a keen watcher of the game. He mentioned that when going for the Eels job in 2024.
I seem Richo's name popping up but if the idea is keeping MON and giving him help, Richo is not that as he would just undermine. Richo needs to be in control overall and he has earned that right. If you are going Richo, you sack MON. Simple as that.
I do not mind you idea of Ryles being that eventually I think he would be good at that. He was head of pathways at Melbourne before coming here. But to do that he needs to be here for a while and winning a comp secures that more so.
Bluey, What I will say may shock you somewhat but from an "agents mouth" i have been told that at Parramatta that the coaches both BA and JR have had the total say in who they recruit. The agent (obviously no names), has been doing it for years and currently manages some Parra players. No mention of that period 2005/14, I would expect no values from that period would have passed through away from the review post renaissance.
Mark O'Neill is a conduit and that's the extent of his authority. As a club he is the first contact on available players that are looking to move etc, the email goes to MON and he goes to Ryles to gauge interest..... the reply goes back we could be interested and how much? alternatively no interest.
If it then goes to a next stage, Ryles is enabled into the interview. So much power as general Manager Football Operations is non existent from MONS perspective, obviously his opinions would be forthcoming but with no power of veto..
MON is regarded by the agents as intelligent and approachable but with no final say or power. he is actually well respected.
I agree about the negotiation stage, that MON needs help, but he doesn't get to that stage, other than as a proxy for Ryles.This type of negotiation which you and me would be always be cognisant of given a business background does not seem part of marketing techniques. I would assume that Ryles coming from his background in Easts and Storm would not have seen that sort of argy bargy either.....remember Ryles saying he found his first year of coaching was much more intensive in the R&R area that he was used to. BA most certainly would not have been experienced in that aspect as well, he is/was very vanilla......must have learnt something when he convinced Lomax to come across notwithstanding.
It was also confirmed that the Galvin exercise was a setup with people in the know, knowing he was always going to the dogs, KK was a similar situation, with very large TPA's involved.
There is no doubt we need some of the old hards in the management of these processes, or even employing an agent with in the club, to handle same.
Cmon you are making it sound like he is just a PA to the coach....stop being an apologist for MON and at least agree that he has been poor at best and totally incompetent at the the very worst.....Poppa ...geez
If you were working for me Parra G....the first thing I would say in our corporate planning process would be
"You weren't listening to the message I was sending" i.e
.stop being an apologist for MON and at least agree that he has been poor at best and totally incompetent at the the very worst.....Poppa ...geez
What you are saying here PG is stop apologising for our bad performances and accept that the blame needs to be agreed upon...... but you have not really come up with an alternative value......so what is your point? in wanting this aknowledgment?
I have set a scene of 3 seperate protaganists, and maybe a reason why they have not come up with desired results and even gone so far as to make a suggestion.
On my report I would say "good soldier" shows little to no leadership.....limited future at any level higher than he is currently placed.
Who am I writing that about PG? Mons, JS, BG......who??
Yes PG its you!
I will move on and adress some of the other comments.
Who in your summation leads the negotiations and works out the black and white details of a players contract. Whom ever that person is, is the person that needs help. There are only 4 on the R&R committee. Sarantinos, O'Neil, Ryles, Rogers.
Are you suggesting it's Sarantinos or Ryles that is negotiating with player managers, and managing the salary cap.
At the end of the day, it dosnt really matter whomever it is or who the collective are, they need help, they need someone that is respected , can get the players they go after. I believe you when you say O'Neil is respected by player managers, but i saw an interview with Dylan Brown about his last contract with the Eels and how he and his manager pushed stupid requests in the form of contract clauses, and laughed about it when the club agreed to them. That was not showing respect, that was a complete bitch slap across the face to who ever approved it at the club.That right there is an example of how out of their depth our negotiator was at that time. We have to be better.
Bluey, I wrote a long summation in the form of the blog....
You now ask me questions that I cannot answer and make no apologies for same i.e.
How would I know who leads the negotiations and works out the b/w details? I was suggesting unequivalently that the final decision was with the coach.....my informant said that and I do not know otherwise.
You state that it doesn't matter who it is ....they need help......was that not what i said in my blog and in reply to your post?
No worries, i thought you had some inside scoop Pops, with the player manager angle. I was hoping to learn something. I was agreeing with you re the last paragraph, just adding my thoughts as well.
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